Animating?

  • #70, by GlenfxMonday, 20. February 2017, 06:45 7 years ago
    @F_Kal, Thanks for the link, proper 3D models support would be great specially for characters, the .X format is kind of the worst to work with, it would be great if there was .fbx, obj and/or dae format support.

    I also love adventure games with several extra animations in the characters, it makes the game more alive and is fun seen the characters perform in unique or varied ways.

    PS: Thank you! grin

    PPS: if someone has info on how to bring 3D characters with animations from maya, I would really appreciate it grin.

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  • #71, by afrlmeMonday, 20. February 2017, 12:15 7 years ago
    Marian uses Cinema 4D for creating all of the backgrounds, general animations & characters & their animations. Back when I joined in the development of A Little Less Desperation he had no plans on creating unique character animations, but after a little push he tried animating some & ended up liking that we now had unique character animations for interacting with scene objects.

    The plan for the actual game is to create unique animations for as many things as possible. I would like unique talk/expression & gesture animations too. We tried out a few for when he talked in the demo, but they were quite basic (there's one bit in the demo that references the killer rabbit from Monty Python's Holy Grail where I got him to create me some finger quotes - they came out a bit funny, but I managed to rescue them to a degree by reordering & deleting certain frames). We decided to have character blink dynamically too, so we'd have him blink once or twice after x random idle loops.

    It's a lot of work for both Marian - him having to create the art & rig up the animations & for myself having to select the best frames, implement them & figure out the best timings & interaction positions. He always tells me that the global pause value should be x, but more often than not I've usually had to delete a few unwanted frames or add some additional frames which means the animations now play slower or faster than they should. I think the end result is worth it though. wink

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  • #72, by MachtnixMonday, 20. February 2017, 21:26 7 years ago
    The plan for the actual game is to create unique animations for as many things as possible. I would like unique talk/expression & gesture animations too.
    If you have a complet mesh and a rig the unique animations aren't not the problem. The big problem (in my Cinema version) is that you have to build one rig and one mesh for each character (because of weight maps). You have 100 animations for ONE person, bur zero for another. In fact I use the same rig (and mesh) as often as possible because rigging and weighting take a long time.

    In the newer versions this isn't a problem any longer, there are tools to put a rig to another character. Today there are standard human rigs all over there.

    Second: to build and light every stage in a 3D-program takes the most time. If you want to create a realistic game. I think it's a job for more than one person...

    That means: for me it is faster to draw than using a 3D tool *lol*

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  • #73, by bonesMonday, 20. February 2017, 21:57 7 years ago
    Just chiming in here - long time user of Visionaire, but haven't posted anything here in a long while.

    Dragonbones support in Visionaire would be truly awesome - although perhaps that support is already built-in via Spine? In one of the posts in another topic it was mentioned that Visionaire already can import Spine characters (if someone can confirm this, would be great!).

    Dragonbones can export Spine data as well - although I believe it relies on a Chinese server to do so, which I have heard is sometimes off-line.

    Alternatively, COA Tools for Blender does the same thing (cut-out characters), but the animation editor is of course by far superior. And freely available as well. https://github.com/ndee85/coa_tools
    Support for that is Godot only, though (there is a point-and-click extension for Godot - might be interesting to look into).

    The reason I ask, because I am on the verge of starting a new point-and-click adventure type game, but I decided I would save myself a LOT of time and effort by switching to cut-out animated characters with mesh deformation. Also, it is possible to attach variables and functions/events to specific frames of a character like that, and it is dead-easy to switch outfits and tools/objects that the character holds in his/her hands.

    In any case, even if Visionaire supports Spine animations, the question is whether we are allowed to release our (even free) games to the public - Spine's licensing demands a $300 payment when the game engine uses Spine animation data, I believe.

    Does anyone here know what the status is? Can Visionaire import Spine data (which would allow us to use Dragonbones) - and what is the status on the licensing if Visionare can indeed import Spine animations?

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  • #74, by LebosteinMonday, 20. February 2017, 22:15 7 years ago
    Visionaire supports frame by frame animation only. But there are hidden functions to use some key frame animation formats? Is that an official import interface? And how Visionaire works with these key frame animations? All animation commands and action parts in Visionaire are tailored to frame by frame animations only. If it should work, how I load and assign such animations inside the character editor for example?

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  • #75, by GlenfxMonday, 20. February 2017, 22:42 7 years ago
    Just chiming in here - long time user of Visionaire, but haven't posted anything here in a long while.

    Dragonbones support in Visionaire would be truly awesome - although perhaps that support is already built-in via Spine? In one of the posts in another topic it was mentioned that Visionaire already can import Spine characters (if someone can confirm this, would be great!).

    Dragonbones can export Spine data as well - although I believe it relies on a Chinese server to do so, which I have heard is sometimes off-line.

    The reason I ask, because I am on the verge of starting a new point-and-click adventure type game, but I decided I would save myself a LOT of time and effort by switching to cut-out animated characters with mesh deformation. Also, it is possible to attach variables and functions/events to specific frames of a character like that, and it is dead-easy to switch outfits and tools/objects that the character holds in his/her hands.

    In any case, even if Visionaire supports Spine animations, the question is whether we are allowed to release our (even free) games to the public - Spine's licensing demands a $300 payment when the game engine uses Spine animation data, I believe.

    Does anyone here know what the status is? Can Visionaire import Spine data (which would allow us to use Dragonbones) - and what is the status on the licensing if Visionare can indeed import Spine animations?
    I tested exporting a character from dragonbones as .Json file and visionaire didn't recognize it (I think that's the spine format you refer to?). I didn't see a spine specific export (I would need to look that up though).

    About the license fee, I'm no lawyer, but spine can't force you to pay a fee you didn't agree with, they might have asked a license fee to the dragonbones creators if they use a code from spine (in their case a code for file compatibility), but they cant force end users to pay one as well without clear notice from dragonbones creators.

    I think it works the same way you can't add .PSD import/export features in painting applications without paying adobe a license fee for the use of that file format, but the end users don't have to pay a license to use that feature in the painting application that uses it.

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  • #76, by bonesTuesday, 21. February 2017, 00:15 7 years ago
    I did a bit more research:
    Load the json-file with the path control on the bottom for objects or with 3d model file path control at character settings. Then add animations, go to animation settings and select the animation. If you want to use multiple spine files for a character you need to use a json file that links to them like this:
    {
    
      "multiplexer":"",
    
      "skins": [],
    
      "files": [
    
        {
    
          "name": "PARTS/B_default/aliena_B.json"
    
        },
    
        {
    
          "name": "PARTS/DB_default/aliena_DB.json"
    
        },
    
        {
    
          "name": "PARTS/F_default/aliena_F.json"
    
        }
    
      ]
    
    }
    Source: http://www.visionaire-studio.net/forum/thread/visionaire-stu...

    Dragonbones exports to Spine, but you will need to be online to do so. Select "Spine" in the export options. I have no idea whether version 3.3 or 2.1 is supported by Visionaire. I tested both versions, and Visionaire loads them.

    However, when I test the game or look in the outfits animation, the graphics do not show up. I am able to see and assign all the animations of the character in the outfits and animations, though.

    I believe this has to do with the path, and Visionaire is unable to load up the required assets. And I am not sure to export the character parts as individual parts, or whether I am allowed to save those in one file?

    Does anyone know how I should set this up? I also tried changing the file path in the JSON file, but I found no fix so far.




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  • #77, by afrlmeTuesday, 21. February 2017, 00:28 7 years ago
    I think Lua is only required for loading in multiple spine json files for single character/scene object. Otherwise can just load in single model file. I've not used it, but I believe that's what David wrote in the thread you linked.

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  • #78, by bonesTuesday, 21. February 2017, 00:40 7 years ago
    I think Lua is only required for loading in multiple spine json files for single character/scene object. Otherwise can just load in single model file. I've not used it, but I believe that's what David wrote in the thread you linked.

    Would you happen to know how to get the graphics to load up correctly? What path will be used (what path do 3d objects use for their textures in Visionaire - perhaps that will guide me to an answer)?

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  • #79, by afrlmeTuesday, 21. February 2017, 01:33 7 years ago
    I think Lua is only required for loading in multiple spine json files for single character/scene object. Otherwise can just load in single model file. I've not used it, but I believe that's what David wrote in the thread you linked.

    Would you happen to know how to get the graphics to load up correctly? What path will be used (what path do 3d objects use for their textures in Visionaire - perhaps that will guide me to an answer)?
    3D objects have to be .x format I believe - can't tell you any more than that as I stay away from the 3D side of the engine. You should be able to load exported Spine files into 3D characters tab or into the 3D object path box thing in properties tab of scene objects - again unconfirmed as I don't own Spine. Too expensive for me.

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  • #80, by bonesTuesday, 21. February 2017, 02:06 7 years ago
    3D objects have to be .x format I believe - can't tell you any more than that as I stay away from the 3D side of the engine. You should be able to load exported Spine files into 3D characters tab or into the 3D object path box thing in properties tab of scene objects - again unconfirmed as I don't own Spine. Too expensive for me.
    I got it to work! I downloaded the free Spine viewer to test the exported spine file from the Esoteric Software site (http://esotericsoftware.com/spine-skeleton-viewer) and loaded up the Spine file that I exported in Dragonbones.

    At first the graphic elements wouldn't show up in there either, but after some quick testing I discovered I had to move the assets to the same folder as the JSON file, and it works!!!

    Visionaire is a bit crash-prone when playing these animations in the editor - after changing the animation center, it seemed quite stable, though, and Visionaire plays all the animations in the editor as well.

    It looks awesome. I have the giant fire demon from Dragonbones running absolutely smooth in the minimum test setup game (with the mars background). A small issue with the mouse offset remains at this point: at the right of this screen the position where the user clicks and the position the character moves to are off.

    Spine test demo project files download: http://estructor.altervista.org/Dragonbones_test.zip
    (updated the file: I uploaded the wrong one before.)

    Anyway, it seems we now have a FREE option to import Spine-based cut-out animated characters into Visionaire!!! Dragonbones! http://dragonbones.com/en/
    (With the caveat that Dragonbones must be online to export to Spine, and we have to login for this service.)


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